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VictoiseC
05-23-2007, 12:42 PM
Well, I just noticed Dink's post about being afraid to fly with needles. Which leads me to finally post my fear. I haven't flown since 9/11. I live in Manhattan and watched the smoke and smell for weeks. Then 2) that other plane went down, the Domenican Republic plane, out at JFK. And 3) my neighbor across the street had a ticket for that plane but hurt his back and canceled last minute.

So I decided I just wouldn't fly anymore. Problem is, my husband is having his 2nd yearly conference in Naples, Florida next month. Last year his boss and he wanted me to go. I stayed home. This year I really want to go coz also my Mother in Law is in Ft. Lauderdale and she is 93 and really wants us to come there. I haven't visited her there since 9/11.

I'm sort of determined to go. I used to fly all over the world! Mexico, Spain, Italy, Greece, Paris, London, Zurich. It's ridiculous but I feel like I really don't want TO DIE on a plane. Whew. Ok. Sorry this was so long. I know I have to die somehow.....

Any thoughts on how stupid this is or how I might just get over it? :shock:

lostchyld
05-23-2007, 01:07 PM
It's not really stupid. I was nervous about flying the first time I got on a plane after 9/11, then my shoes set off the metal detector, this was before they required everyone to get their socks dirty. After that first security checkpoint, old habits came back and the hardest thing to deal with was the paranoia. That was the summer of '02. Two years after that, my family dragged me to Hawaii, and I do mean dragged. Two weeks over Christmas in a hotel room with my parents and sibs is definitely not how I would have wanted to do Hawaii. Just this spring, I flew to Houston for an interview.

The best way to get over the nerves is to just go do it. You'll be fine and you'll have a great time seeing your mom and the flying nerves will go away.

Miss Moosey
05-23-2007, 01:08 PM
Definitely NOT stupid! I used to detest flying and spent the entire flight digging into my mom's arm with my fingernails. She hated flying, too.

But it is the fear that you should get over; if the fear interferes with what you do and how you live your life it needs to be dealt with.

I feel like one of the best ways to get over it is to simply fly again. But it would probably be wise to see a psychologist who can help you come up with a calming routine you can do on the plane if you tense up (perhaps knitting can be a part of that; it's a part of mine xxx!). A calming routine can make a big difference.

If you fly again you will be very happy that you did.

Rebecca

iza
05-23-2007, 01:10 PM
Victoise, this not stupid! These fears have nothing logical, and they can start anytime. In your case I think it makes total sense why you're scared. You might suffer from a type of post-traumatic stress disorder.

Have you considered consulting someone? If you think it might be too difficult for you to fly and deal with this alone, maybe it could be a solution. My mom is a counsellor and she had treated dozens of people with all kinds of fears. She says it's too bad people don't consult more for these kinds of problems, because it's easy to treat and generally requires only a few consultations. And it makes such a difference in people's lives!:hug:

AnnaT
05-23-2007, 01:31 PM
Well, I just noticed Dink's post about being afraid to fly with needles. Which leads me to finally post my fear. I haven't flown since 9/11. I live in Manhattan and watched the smoke and smell for weeks. Then 2) that other plane went down, the Domenican Republic plane, out at JFK. And 3) my neighbor across the street had a ticket for that plane but hurt his back and canceled last minute.


I didn't want to fly before 9/11, so you are ahead of me. And I don't have your trauma and memories of being in Manhattan that day. And after 9/11...forget it. I'd felt like something would happen in New York for some time, so in 2000, when I had to go to Greece for a visit, I pushed and harassed and nagged my husband to arrange for us to fly out of Boston (:ick:), even though it was not convenient at all. I learned a big lesson from that on 9/11, although it's hard to say exactly what that lesson was. If it's going to happen, it's going to happen and I don't appear to be able to control it. :-(

So I decided I just wouldn't fly anymore. Problem is, my husband is having his 2nd yearly conference in Naples, Florida next month. Last year his boss and he wanted me to go. I stayed home. This year I really want to go coz also my Mother in Law is in Ft. Lauderdale and she is 93 and really wants us to come there. I haven't visited her there since 9/11.


It's so hard to completely avoid flying. I'll tell you the truth, I had a massive dose of Xanax for my last flight (when I moved here). Massive. I still didn't want to fly, but I just didn't really care. :|
I think the incentive of seeing your elderly MIL is a strong one.

I'm sort of determined to go. I used to fly all over the world! Mexico, Spain, Italy, Greece, Paris, London, Zurich. It's ridiculous but I feel like I really don't want TO DIE on a plane. Whew. Ok. Sorry this was so long. I know I have to die somehow.....

Any thoughts on how stupid this is or how I might just get over it? :shock:


I feel exactly the same way. Statistics help me, a little. It's just so unlikely that anything will happen. I think that fears are pretty normal. We wouldn't survive without the instinct of fear. It's just when the fear hinders us from having a normal life that it becomes a problem. Whenever I get to go back to the U.S. for a visit, I plan to get me a big ol' prescription once again. :mrgreen:

I'm glad that you are determined to go.

marykz
05-23-2007, 02:02 PM
while your brain may recognize your fear might not be rational, your heart is afraid. it isn't stupid.

just getting over it? might not be that easy, but yeah- just be prepared, and walk on that plane. how do we get prepared? practice. what are you going to pack? what are you going to bring? are you going to drive the the airport? where should you park? do you know what security is like at your airport?

Think about successful flights- you board, cram yourself into a seat by the window, listen to the flight attendant, take off, (for me with eyes closed) fly for a while, and land. then you grab your stuff, deplane, and go get a big glass of wine.

I totally agree with maybe having a couple counseling sessions, or asking a doctor for a mild tranquilzer. for me, takeoff is the worst part. but, having a plan, and looking forward to the destination get me there.
you can do it!

Kaydee
05-23-2007, 02:50 PM
Don't let your fear keep you from doing things you're going to enjoy. I've always been afraid to fly...I too sometimes have to take a Xanax before a flight, maybe you should talk to your doctor about that I'm sure they'd be willing to help. I have to admit that I was actually more scared to fly before 9/11. The first time I got on a plane after 9/11 was that December, and surprisingly I felt more at ease than I susally had. I think its seeing all of the crazy security at the airport (even thought it can be annoying) that made me realize the chances of something happening again would be so small. I've heard that you have a better chance of winning the lottery or getting struck by lightening twice than getting into a plane accident....so really the chances of something happening are sooooo slim. I've read that the first 60 seconds after takeoff are when something would most likely occur, so a trick I use is to count to 200 or so, and then I feel much safer. I know it can be scary but this trip is a good time to work on overcoming your fear and not let it hinder you from having some great experiences in your life.

Ronda
05-23-2007, 03:05 PM
I have never been in a plane, and I don't think I ever will get in one. I can't explain my fear. I'm not afraid of heights. I'm afraid of CRASHING. I don't find your fear stupid at all. It has its basis in reality. I don't know that mine does. My husband keeps telling me he wants to go to Hawaii. I told him to go and send me a postcard. Next year we plan on going to Florida - again - for about the 7th time - by car - a 24-hour drive. Ugh.

HamaLee
05-23-2007, 03:27 PM
A lot of airports and airlines have "courses" for people who are terrified of flying. They basically give you tons of information to help ease your mind and sometimes culminate with a short flight. You could look into some of these.

I also recommend talking to your doctor and possibly getting a prescription for tranquilizers. If you're not traveling alone, go ahead with the heavy-duty ones! Honestly, sometimes it just takes getting over that hump the first time--and the first time you may need some pharmalogical help. :teehee:

Good luck! Think of how WONDERFUL Florida will be if you conquer this demon!

Limey
05-23-2007, 03:40 PM
If you're THAT windy, get the train.

Limey

SandraEllen
05-23-2007, 03:51 PM
I'm terrified of flying, but I still do it. Even by myself. I tell myself, "it'll be okay. it'll be okay." and then, when the plane is taking off, i hang onto the arm rests like my life depends on it. :oops: after we're in the air, i'm fine... :shrug:

zip
05-23-2007, 04:03 PM
It isn't a stupid fear. It's rational because you're willingly giving up control to someone else and you can't even yell at him to "watch out!" You can't pump the invisible brake on the passenger floorboard. Something that huge isn't supposed to be able to fly. It's crazy not to fear it. ;)

I take a 2 mg valium before flying and I don't drink during the flight because turbulence freaks me out and landing is the worst part of any flight (to me.) Take the pill, enjoy the takeoff (I love the takeoff!) and then lose myself in the in-house movie or in my iPod and knitting. And don't even think about how young the pilot is.

My SO's son-in-law is a pilot and I know how stringent the rules have become. I hope you're able to overcome your fears and enjoy the journey.

zkimom
05-23-2007, 07:35 PM
You should go anyway.

Really.

My dh flies all the time, all over the world and so do the guys who work for us.

After 9/11 -- we are transplanted NYers living in CT -- he had to get right back up in the air as soon as there were planes flying again. He hasn't looked back and other than the inconvenience of the security hassles at the airport, it's just another day at work for him.

I just flew for the first time in years (I used to travel for my job before I had kids) and it was no biggie. I was really nervous at first but the champagne in Business class worked wonders.

Don't let fear keep you from having fun and experiencing life. I figure if it's my time to go, it won't matter if I'm getting on a plane or on a bus or just walking out the door of my house.

Best,
Susan

KermieLVR
05-23-2007, 10:28 PM
I,too, have never flown. We, too, want to take another trip to FL next Spring Break and my husband is convinced that I can do it... fly... I get sick everytime I think about it and it's a year away. Friends just laugh and say it's nothing. I would really need a POWERFUL drug to get me on the plane.... the kind that if the plane was heading straight down, I'd be like, "cooooooooooooool!"

I totally get that fear. Good luck with your driving!

AnnaT
05-24-2007, 03:44 AM
It isn't a stupid fear. It's rational because you're willingly giving up control to someone else and you can't even yell at him to "watch out!" You can't pump the invisible brake on the passenger floorboard. Something that huge isn't supposed to be able to fly. It's crazy not to fear it. ;)

I take a 2 mg valium before flying and I don't drink during the flight because turbulence freaks me out and landing is the worst part of any flight (to me.) Take the pill, enjoy the takeoff (I love the takeoff!) and then lose myself in the in-house movie or in my iPod and knitting. And don't even think about how young the pilot is.

My SO's son-in-law is a pilot and I know how stringent the rules have become. I hope you're able to overcome your fears and enjoy the journey.


You wrote a good post! I will add, however, that I think it's better not to know how it flies. :mrgreen: My husband is a mechanical and civil engineer and believe me, I felt worse after he told me about some engineering principles that make flight possible. :shock:

I hate takeoff but love landing, because it means it's all over. :happydance:

VictoiseC
05-24-2007, 10:15 AM
while your brain may recognize your fear might not be rational, your heart is afraid. it isn't stupid.

Think about successful flights- you board, cram yourself into a seat by the window, listen to the flight attendant, take off, (for me with eyes closed) fly for a while, and land. then you grab your stuff, deplane, and go get a big glass of wine.

I totally agree with maybe having a couple counseling sessions, or asking a doctor for a mild tranquilizer. for me, takeoff is the worst part. but, having a plan, and looking forward to the destination get me there.
you can do it!


That's such good stuff.... yup take off scares me more than landing.


Limey, that's the funniest reply, I'm going to think "I'm sooooo windy I'm so windy" when that plane takes off, maybe it'll help the take off. :lol:

THANKS all of you for such good advice and wise words. I know I just got to get back on the plane.

I wanted to drive to FL from NY (Ronda) like you but my DH just wouldn't do it. ( we went to Hawaii 15 years ago, it's absolutely incredible!!! hint hint) The other factor is I have two cats!!! we are taking with us (they've flown a lot also) and driving would be 3 days there and 3 back.

I know, all those statistics .... car accidents I've heard are much higher. It's just the crashing part.
Funny, when you have a fear you can feed it or not.
Like I'm a Libra an air sign, afraid to fly... (that doesn't make sense) and Natalie Wood (remember her) was always afraid of water and she died by water.

Iza, yes, counseling would be good. I live in NY though, they charge an arm and a leg for any counseling, I just can't afford it. It would be interesting to do that though. I thought I might mention something to one of the priests at my church. I used to get through the take off by praying. That seems to have worked so far!
(re counseling: there's this joke about being from Michigan like me: you have to find yourself running across your front yard NAKED before you admit you might have a problem and need help)


I wonder if our airport or airlines do have any sort of course, that's interesting. I'll check it out.

I'm glad to know the pilots have to go through a lot of training etc. (Did they ever decide to let them carry guns, I forgot.) It's basically about bombs for me though.

Relinquishing Control. Umhmm. Well, ok! My dh is on the phone right now talking about visiting his mum and that's a good thing. Swimming in pools! The resort where we're going has a big tall slide in a huge pool so I'll try to KEEP THINKING ABOUT THAT!!:rofl:
We haven't gone on a vacation in years and even though this is his business conference, it's family friendly and well, I sure love to swim.
:muah: thanks again

zip
05-30-2007, 11:50 PM
:thumbsup: A positive attitude will get you through the journey more easily and make it more fun!

redwitch
05-31-2007, 01:38 AM
Take your knitting! Just remember that people are killed in car accidents every day, you have seen them yourself. That doesn't make you stop driving or riding in cars right? The only difference is that you are used to being in cars, but you don't fly every day. (actually two differences, the second is that flying is safer than being in a car)
On the road you have to worry about what other cars will do - one of them could hit you. That's not going to happen on a plane! Just have your knitting close at hand and knit through takeoff!
Good luck
Sarah

msoebel
05-31-2007, 11:52 AM
I fly about once a year. I do not enjoy flying, and like you, I am not afraid of heights. I am afraid of crashing.

But these are the things I whisper under my breath whenever I start to feel a little queasy from the nervousness:

-Many, Many, Many more car accidents than airplane crashes occur every year. And I drive several times a day with minor issues. I've seen someone die at the site of a car accident. I've never seen a plane crash.

-If the plane does crash, chances are I will die instantly, and not suffer (I am not afraid of dying, it's the pain that terrifies me!).

-The pilot doesn't want to die today either.

I am a big baby when it comes to flying, but having a husband who gets air sick and a toddler who needs my attention really helps to get my mind off it. I almost always have to fly on one of those "toy" airplanes with the 12 year old pilot for at least one of my connecting flights...and I am still alive.

Go to Florida...Face the fear. If you can pick up sharp and pointy needles and face the imminent danger that arises from knitting, you can fly. You can do this.

Misty

Jeremy
05-31-2007, 01:50 PM
I'm on the upper west side of Manhattan occasionally and I'm a lot more afraid of the taxis than I am of flying. I do understand though that this isn't a logic thing at all. Counseling would be a good idea. Good luck.

jodstr2
05-31-2007, 02:00 PM
I'm afraid of flying because I get terrible motion sickness. I haven't flown since 2003. I'm in a wedding next March in Hawaii and just thinking about having to go there makes me almost have an anxiety attack.

VictoiseC
05-31-2007, 06:28 PM
Thanks Sarah, Misty.... all you guys.

Sarah, the problem is ha relinquishing control. I know all about the more car accidents per year (my dh keeps telling me that one) but the ol' ego says, oh I could grab the wheel and avert the accident or some such gibberish. So, basically it's putting trust in another person. The pilots. I'd give anything to have a long conversation with a few pilots. That would help.

I think about John Travolta!!!! (I used to live in Bay Ridge when he made Being Alive) he's flying his private jets all over the place all the time.

Some people love flying, some the water... I love the couch. :happydance: Knitting, gardening. Not flying. But Misty you are so right, about facing fears.

Sorry about the motion sickness Jodi. My mum had that too. She had a couple drinks before take off but I don't like to drink in the morning. Let me tell you one good thing: Hawaii is so worth it. We went years ago and I still remember how beautiful it is.

And Jeremy!!! I live on the upper west side! Just give those taxi drivers a .... well something, but don't wait for them, make them wait for you. (when crossing walks etc.) You have to show them who's in charge that's all!!!

jodstr2
05-31-2007, 06:38 PM
I grew up in Hawaii, and flew several times a year (interisland as well as mainland and international) between the ages of 4 and 32. but now I'm afraid. hopefully I can with with my doctor to find some kind of drug to prevent sickness/calm me down.

Knitting_Guy
05-31-2007, 07:47 PM
The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.

The brave person isn't less afraid, they simply act despite the fear.

cheesiesmom
05-31-2007, 08:28 PM
Well, I can finally step up and give you my "advice".

I turned 60 in Feb and my DH 65 in Mar. 2 weeks ago, we made our first flight to AZ to visit the DD. Maybe it's our age, or maybe it's our "what will be will be" attitude, or a basic fatalism, but it was a "snap" My son (30) is also a-feared of flying (sounds like Erica Jung), but I'm determined that the next time we make the trip, he's coming too. We always took the kids on road trips and thoroughly enjoyed them. Flying is boring and noisy and my mobility issues makes it really hard for me to get in and out of the teensy tiny seats; but I'm not going to let some irrational fear stop me from living what life I have left. (Sorry if that sounds weird.) We have horrendous traffic accidents every day in our area (Metro Detroit has NO convenient public transit; everybody drives their own cars, sober or drunk). But there hasn't been a major airline crash is several years.

My hubby and I always talked about touring Europe and didn't. Now I have muscle problems we can't. All because we were nervous about flying. Shame on us. We've missed so much.

I said a few prayers and put myself in God's hands. I can't say it was enjoyable. (As I said, BOR-ING!) I didn't get a chance to "sing" my way 'cross country (Wabash Cannonball, Missouri Walz, Oklahoma, etc; the kids used to hate that), but if flying is the only way I'll get to see my little girl, then I'm up for it.

Telling you to "get over it" is too simplistic, but take heart, we will survive and undoubtedly die in our beds.

And as FDR and Knitting Guy put it, Nothing to fear but fear itself.

Good luck!:muah:


gladys

KnittingNora
05-31-2007, 10:11 PM
I am terrified - I am the sort of person who can understand people trying to open the door to get off midair :ick:
To someone who isn't frightened of flying, it does seem a completely irrational fear! And when I don't have a trip booked and know I don't have to get on a plane, I can rationally accept it is the safest form of transport and all the rest of it. But, book me a flight and all the rational thoughts go out the window!
However, we now live in Singapore, and it is impossible to NOT fly here. To get anywhere, I have to fly. So am now flying probably 6 or 7 trips a year, which keeps me awake at night sometimes :pout:
I have to take a form of valium, otherwise I just wouldn't be able to get on the plane. I even get nervous when I take my husband to the airport for one of his many business trips.... just the smell of jet fuel and sound of the engines makes me go weak at the knees.
Anyway, the point of this long reply is, once I get anywhere, I have a fantastic time. OK, so the last day is a bit overshadowed by the flight back for me, but at least I have been and had a great holiday, visit to family etc.
I would go and see your doctor and get him to prescribe something for you... it doesn't take the fear away completely, but it does help. And of course makes you less annoying to other travellers haha!! (I once clung to my husband so hard on a flight he got so hot he was actually sick, lucky he is extremely patient and understanding with me. And he LOVES flying)
Good luck with your trip, trust me, once you have got off the plane the other end and see your mother in law it will be worth it :thumbsup:

VictoiseC
06-12-2007, 12:22 PM
The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.

The brave person isn't less afraid, they simply act despite the fear.
Whew!!!!! Brook, Gladys, Nora.... and Mason, thanks for the replies and telling me all about your experiences. That's DARN right about fear of fear. I lit a candle in my church this past sunday for me of all people, because I am getting on that flight on Thursday!

Funny thing, we couldn't get someone to take care of our cats until Thursday so my husband flew today alone. He will get to spend a couple days alone with his mum then I show up on Thursday for a couple nights then off to Naples Grand Resort. (we haven't had a vacation for years, even though this is business it will be holiday-like also). So I will be flying ALONE ha ha but at least there will be someone to take care of the cats if.... oh never mind! positive thoughts positive thoughts

Gladys... I'm from Michigan but left a long time ago. I have many relatives there (up near Flint) who have never and never will get on a plane. It's amazing. (good for you!) I am glad I was so fearless when I was younger and went all over Europe including Czechoslovakia where my grandparents came from. And Mexico, Puerto Rico, many places that were so worth flying to. So.
I'm not taking any valium. I'm just taking my KNITTING!!!! And praying a lot. It is God's will after all isn't it, whenever I'm to be pulled off this grand ol' place. oh boy. Think I'll stop talking about it and go knit a bit. Thanks again!

Kaydee
06-12-2007, 02:11 PM
I'm so glad you're going on your trip! Have a wonderful time! You're going to be fine...I know it!

Jane Untangled
06-12-2007, 03:07 PM
It's strange, isn't it? The older and more experienced we get, the more aware of our mortality we become. Anyway, these days 'm less afraid of flying than my white knuckle days (I vaguely remember clutching some poor seatmate on a flight home to Halifax because we kept hitting potholes up there). I think I'm a little more fatalistic thinking 'if it happens, it happens. Can't stop living because you're afraid to die'.

Don't let this fear strangle you!

Jane http://www.janethornley.com/blog/index.php/site/KnittersCorner/

hummingbird
06-12-2007, 04:50 PM
VictoiseC,
In one of your posts you mentioned that you'd like to talk to a pilot about this. I'm a pilot. You can PM me or we could set up a phone call or whatever.
I'll try my best to answer whatever questions you or anyone else here has.

whiskers
06-12-2007, 07:55 PM
you will be so happy you conquered your fear once u do fly again, and like said above, check into those airline courses. they might make u feel more secure. you will have a great time in fl. :lol:

zip
06-12-2007, 08:36 PM
VictoiseC,
In one of your posts you mentioned that you'd like to talk to a pilot about this. I'm a pilot. You can PM me or we could set up a phone call or whatever.
I'll try my best to answer whatever questions you or anyone else here has.


So... do you knit while you pilot?


:shifty: