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sandy57th
02-14-2010, 07:06 PM
Just got a phone call from my pissed off friend, who had flown from Chicago to Utah. She took her Boye Balene knitting needles in her carry on bag. She brought dpns and circulars, just in case they took one, she'd have the other-- she was knitting socks and likes both dpns and magic loop. They are cheap, so having them taken wouldn't make her nuts, and they are slightly flexible, so not the more dangerous looking metal or solid wood. The socks were partially knit and she had the instructions with her. It was clear she was actually knitting socks. They wouldn't let her take any knitting needles in her carry on, they took both the circs and the dpns from her. P.S.: she is very calm and professional looking, is well educated and comes across that way-- there was nothing to make anyone suspicious.

She went to a her LYS's knitting circle this morning and shared her story-- and another woman there said the same thing happened going from Boston to Philadelphia last week. These are not international flights. Flyers, beware: it sounds like the odds of getting your needles taken, no matter what kind or what your destination, is getting a lot higher.

NorthernIrelandKnitter
02-14-2010, 07:21 PM
In this part of the world - UK - taking knitting needles in your carry-on luggage is a definite no-no. Security, especially at the airports in Northern Ireland, where I live, is very strict. I did manage to take on bamboo needles on one flight as those don't show up on x-ray.

Have you ever tried finger knitting? No need for any needles with that!

Gillian

LifeIsGood
02-14-2010, 10:55 PM
Interesting because this is the offical word from the TSA. (http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtravel/assistant/editorial_1252.shtm)

sandy57th
02-14-2010, 11:45 PM
I know, this is my point. No matter what the official word or what anyone tells you, they may take them.

AngelaR
02-15-2010, 12:40 AM
I spoke with an acquaintance at TSA about this as we are planning on a trip at Spring Break and I was told that it depends on the ignorance of the TSA agent at the terminal and time you fly. She told me that there had been a dust up of sorts at the Philadelphia air port last year when a woman sat next to another woman on a flight who was knitting. The lady demanded, upon landing, on speaking to a TSA supervisor. She demanded they send her needles (no idea what kind, but they had to be nice) sent to her at the agent's expense. She said she figured that way that agent would know the rules from now on and how to do her job.

I had to laugh when she told the story because it sounds like something my grandmother would have done.

Belphoebe
02-15-2010, 12:52 AM
Can you still pack your knitting in luggage you check? I understand carry on to a point, but still....

OldSkool
02-15-2010, 02:46 AM
Ya know, I would print that page off of the TSA website and throw it in their faces (not literally because they've got a crappy job/are just trying to do their jobs which is to protect you while you are in a tin can 35K miles above the Earth/they're human beings too) to prove to them that, although knitting is an addiction, it's still harmless... relatively. Some of them probably do not receive the proper training and/or are excessively protective.
:)

etoilechaude
02-15-2010, 03:32 AM
Ya know, I would print that page off of the TSA website and throw it in their faces (not literally because they've got a crappy job/are just trying to do their jobs which is to protect you while you are in a tin can 35K miles above the Earth/they're human beings too) to prove to them that, although knitting is an addiction, it's still harmless... relatively. Some of them probably do not receive the proper training and/or are excessively protective.
:)

Indeed!!! I think printing off the TSA page is a great thing to do!!! I am a STUBBORN brat though :o)

suzeeq
02-15-2010, 10:36 AM
Having your knitting in your checked luggage is no problem.

Mirl56
02-15-2010, 10:57 AM
Regardless what is posted on TSA website, it is still up to the individual inspector whether to allow or not. I don't think you'll get to far beyond pissing them off if you try to point out to them knitting needles are allowed.

vaknitter
02-15-2010, 12:51 PM
It really is hit or miss with TSA. I've never had a problem with my knitting...I usually just pull my bag out with a copy of the TSA webpage and say something like - I was so excited to read that knitting is allowed in my carryon again. Never been challenged.
I did however have 2 TSA agents get in a tiff about whether or not I was allowed to walk through the metal detector with a fracture boot on my ankle :roll:

OffJumpsJack
02-15-2010, 02:13 PM
It may be better to print and carry the DHS TSA Amendments to Interpretation. It is a list of prohibited and permissible items. http://www.tsa.gov/assets/pdf/Interpretive_Rule_Lighters.pdf

This document list knitting and crochet needles as permitted toy or hobby items because they pose little risk. Section II.B(1) and blunt tipped scissors are permitted in Section II.A(17).

Plastic or blunt tipped metal scissors and knitting or crochet needles may be carried on one's person or in one's carry or as accessible property (carry-on luggage).

Of course one must not refuse screening, but one may communicate with the screening officer during screening.

:think:
Additional note:

Pillow fee: Instead of paying a fee to the airline for a pillow, one can take a gallon sized zip-lock bag in one's carry-on and inflate for use as a pillow. I think this is also more sanitary.

Blanket fee: Try adding a bath towel to your carry-on. I actually keep two towels in my car for use as lap blankets during winter. Once your car warms up they can be easily removed without interfering with one's driving so long as one's eye/attention remain on the road.

:thumbsup:

sandy57th
02-15-2010, 02:18 PM
You know, I'd love to see the thread about this on some woodcarver's website-- we're just carvers, why can't we take a small knife in our carry on just so we can whittle during long flights, wood carving is an addiction, but harmless, those TSA agents are ignorant, not well trained and overly protective. . .
And then I'd love to see the reaction to anyone here on this thread, sitting next to the guy with the knife in his hand, carving away.

Of course no one here would do anything awful with knitting needles. But there are people who would. I just don't get it when knitters get so irritated about not being able to knit on planes. I take long flights on a regular basis-- and I am the ultimate knitting addict. I know full well how boring it can be. So yes, I would love to be able to knit in the air. But: WE ARE NOT THE ONLY PEOPLE ON THE PLANET. OUR WISH TO KNIT ON AN AIRPLANE MAY NOT BE FULFILLED. A few weeks ago when hanging out at my LYS, one of the women was complaining about how she may not be able to take her knitting on a long flight to Europe. One of the other women snapped at her, "what, are you 5? You sound like my son when I say he can't have his computer games. Get over it." It was a very nasty comment, and I particularly hate that "get over it" thing in any context, but I must admit it struck a chord-- we are grown-ups. We may not get to do exactly what we want on an airplane.

And PS to the plastic or bamboo and the Xray thing that someone mentioned. Have you seen the screens on those machines? They pick up everything in your carry-on, not just metal. They will show the screener everything in your carry-on.

sandy57th
02-15-2010, 02:20 PM
I am very happy to have my right to dying in a terrorist incident on an airplane taken away.

meowmeowmeow
02-15-2010, 02:33 PM
The difference, Sandy, is that you don't mind having your rights taken away, I do.

Might I remind you that

Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Oh but he's not important...just Benjamin Franklin; A founding father.

OffJumpsJack
02-15-2010, 02:50 PM
Sandy57th, being ignorant isn't insulting. It is simply a lack of knowledge. The TSA screener have a tremendously long list of items to remember, both prohibited and permitted. It should be no embarrassment to them nor to their supervisors to offer correct information.

The Department of Homeland Security (DHS) TSA issued an Amendments to Interpertation on March 1, 2005. I provided a link to the pdf in my previous post.

DHS specifically listed knitting and crochet needles as permitted "hobby or other items posing little risk." This list was first issued, Feb. 14, 2003 in the Federal Register. On March 3, 2003, TSA amended the list to prohibit all lighters as it was too difficult for screeners to determine the fuel type. Knitting and crochet needles have never been prohibited.

Also permitted are: Nail clippers, Nail files, and plastic or blunt metal scissors.

If you have ever seen a wood carvers hands, you would realize the absurdity of your comparison. I asked one if he had cut all three or four of the fingers he had bandaged, but he said it happens often enough that he tapes them before he starts to work. I don't think any wood carver would try plying his or her craft in a moving vehicle.

I am very happy to have my right to dying in a terrorist incident on an airplane taken away.

Ignorance is treatable, read and discuss with knowledgeable adults in a open and non hostile way. You should try that.

sandy57th
02-15-2010, 02:58 PM
meow, I have a genuine question for you: Do you think people should be able to get on a flight with a box cutter? Without luggage? Seriously-- where's the line? Are you the one who is going to draw it?

As for rights-- don't be silly, of course I don't want them taken away. But when, as someone else so elquently put it, you are a mile above ground in a tin can with 200 strangers, some things are going to work differently. Anytime you are dealing with other people, the term "rights" changes. I have the right to toss my newspaper on the ground when I'm through with it. But it interferes with other people's rights, so I can't do that. Does it harm them? No. Is it just asthetically unpleasing? Yes. Would you be comfortable sitting next to someone on a plane with a knife, even if that person wasn't doing anything with it? Nope. Are you taking away their rights by agreeing to laws which prohibit that behavior even though it's completely harmless? Yup. Is that okay? Yup, yup, yup.

Here's something I have said before and will say again. I will guarantee that no one who is concerned about their rights being taken away when they sit down in the above mentioned tin can with 200 strangers, about to rise up thousands of feet in the air, knew anyone, or knew anyone who knew anyone who died on 9/11, or lived in lower Manhattan at the time. I will guarantee that no one on this site who argues that everyone should be able to take their knitting needles on an airplane knew anyone, or knew anyone who knew anyone who died on 9/11, or lived in lower Manhattan at the time. An experience like that will change your mind real quick.

I am not a paranoid person, I take the nightly "are you at risk?" news stories with a grain of salt, I think anyone who doesn't vaccinate their child should be arrested, I am not particularly worried about milk past its end date as long as it tastes okay, and I think getting pulled over for going 8 miles over the speed limit is a way for police departments to increase revenue. But there are some people in the world who look at a plane and see a missile with "we're going to get you" written on it, and I for one, would like to keep their little terrorist games out of my airspace. A vigilant TSA agent is in my corner on that one, and I am happy to do whatever they ask.

sandy57th
02-15-2010, 03:02 PM
Offjumpsjack, interesting that you interpret my comment as hostility. I will blame the well-known limitations of Internet communication on that. Absolutely no hostilitly about it. I meant it exactly as I said it: I am very happy to have my right to dying in a terrorist event on an airplane taken away. I assume most people would agree with that. Now, "absurdity of your comparison"?. . .THAT sounds hostile.

OffJumpsJack
02-15-2010, 03:22 PM
Regardless what is posted on TSA website, it is still up to the individual inspector whether to allow or not. I don't think you'll get to far beyond pissing them off if you try to point out to them knitting needles are allowed.

Marilyn,

It would seem the DHS document I linked removed any interpretation for the items listed in it. The trouble is they still have not provided any procedure for addressing misidentification or misclassification of permitted items as prohibited.

If the screener says it is prohibited you have little option. If you politely acknowledge that he or she has a tremendous responsibility made more difficult by a long list of prohibited and nearly as long a list of permitted items.

The real trouble is they apparently have the power to search, seize, and even detain you without warrant or probable cause even though that is contrary to our Fourth Amendment Rights.

It isn't a matter of safety.

Edited to add:
:think:
Sandy, My comment about absurdity wasn't hostile but merely to remove ignorance.

Additionally it is incorrect to compare a knitting needle to a knife or even a screwdriver. Knives and screwdrivers have always been prohibited by the DHS TSA rules and regulations (except screwdrivers in eyeglass repair kits.) Every cub scout (boys from age 8 to 12) who earns a whittling chip (a card showing they know and understand the risk and safety issues of using a knife) knows that a knife is a dangerous tool to be treated with care and respect for its danger.


I will guarantee that no one who is concerned about their rights being taken away when they sit down in the above mentioned tin can with 200 strangers, about to rise up thousands of feet in the air, knew anyone, or knew anyone who knew anyone who died on 9/11.

Well now you have met your first. I knew several people who worked in the the towers and several more who survived those lost. :sad:

meowmeowmeow
02-15-2010, 03:32 PM
meow, I have a genuine question for you: Do you think people should be able to get on a flight with a box cutter? Without luggage? Seriously-- where's the line? Are you the one who is going to draw it?See,Sandy, this is where you allow your personal paranoia to cloud your judgment.As someone already mentioned for you, the whittling is an invalid argument as the TSA does specify you are not to bring knives aboard.I guess since you weren't able to come to this not so brilliant conclusion on your own,I'll try to break it down a little for you:

Knitters will be knitting on board.Box cutters will not be cutting boxes on board.That is where the suspicion should kick in.What is this person going to do?Unpack boxes from his move mid-flight?Is he going to be laying out carpet on the plane?Then where is the logic in carrying what could be seen as dangerous in carry on, not baggage?Certainly, the person had a use or they wouldn't go through the trouble right?This is where it should become obvious what he/she is using the box cutter for.The line isn't that complicated.Just think real hard, Sandy :)I'm sure you'll get it if you try hard enough :)

As for rights-- don't be silly, of course I don't want them taken away.

Well, then...your argument on the issue should stop right here.A right is being taken away.When you think of knitting on a plane, naturally you go over to knitting forums and naturally the TSA comes up and naturally you find their site and naturally you get the pdf Jack put up specifying that you may bring needles aboard and naturally you bring them to the airport and are then naturally confused when an institution contradicts the very rules they specified to begin with :) There is a right being taken away; the right to follow the rules and expect to be appropriately treated when you do so.

But when, as someone else so elquently put it, you are a mile above ground in a tin can with 200 strangers, some things are going to work differently. Anytime you are dealing with other people, the term "rights" changes. I have the right to toss my newspaper on the ground when I'm through with it. But it interferes with other people's rights, so I can't do that. Does it harm them? No. Is it just asthetically unpleasing? Yes. Would you be comfortable sitting next to someone on a plane with a knife, even if that person wasn't doing anything with it? Nope. Are you taking away their rights by agreeing to laws which prohibit that behavior even though it's completely harmless? Yup. Is that okay? Yup, yup, yup.

Actually, Sandy, this is something called littering.It does infringe my rights to walk around and not trip and fall because someone was too lazy to walk over to the designated trash can.Have you ever lived with roommates?Rules on trash come up pretty quickly as your mess would interfere with my right to expect to have access to the stove, bathroom, couch and so on.I am not taking rights away when I prohibit a knife on a plane because those rules were already agreed upon and the person simply chose to disobey.Now if you were to go up to me on the streets and tell me that I am not allowed to own the small knife I wear as a hair clip, I would kindly insist that you shove certain things in certain places and tell you to educate yourself on the standards that have been set in place and then show you how painfully within those standards my knife is.If a crew of S.W.A.T. then came in and tackled me to the ground, put me in prison and confiscated my knife, you'd bet your back side I would have every group who's business it is to defend my rights making those people blush.That would be absurdity.Requesting that you follow the rules would not be.

Here's something I have said before and will say again. I will guarantee that no one who is concerned about their rights being taken away when they sit down in the above mentioned tin can with 200 strangers, about to rise up thousands of feet in the air, knew anyone, or knew anyone who knew anyone who died on 9/11, or lived in lower Manhattan at the time. I will guarantee that no one on this site who argues that everyone should be able to take their knitting needles on an airplane knew anyone, or knew anyone who knew anyone who died on 9/11, or lived in lower Manhattan at the time. An experience like that will change your mind real quick.

Am I supposed to feel left out for not having someone dear to me killed in 9/11?If I were you, I'd be at least a little ashamed of twisting someone's unfortunate death to my own advantage because of failure to prove my point without emotional manipulation :/


I am not a paranoid person, I take the nightly "are you at risk?" news stories with a grain of salt, I think anyone who doesn't vaccinate their child should be arrested, I am not particularly worried about milk past its end date as long as it tastes okay, and I think getting pulled over for going 8 miles over the speed limit is a way for police departments to increase revenue. But there are some people in the world who look at a plane and see a missile with "we're going to get you" written on it, and I for one, would like to keep their little terrorist games out of my airspace. A vigilant TSA agent is in my corner on that one, and I am happy to do whatever they ask.

Actually, Sandy.Going 8 miles over the speed limit is illegal.This is why they call it a speed limit and not a speed suggestion.I don't speed.I don't even go a mile over the speed limit; I tend to go 1 under just in case.It is not my right to speed.It is my right to drive and go the appropriate speed and expect to not be pulled over and given a fine for doing so.I truly hope you learn to respect the right of other people to expect that when they go out on the road, the other drivers obey the law.You would not have to worry about the popo "stealing" your money if you went the speed limit.This is why I drive worry free knowing I will never be fined.

By the way, you're doing a horrid job at keeping terrorist games out of your airspace with this whole paranoiac passion in favor of those who abuse their powers as TSA officers.The paranoia surrounding flights is a result of the tragic 9/11 incidents, and I for one refuse to give into the fear.When we have people here in the US who think it's perfectly fine to freak out and not allow anything on board whether or not it is in within regulation simply because we're a little scared that we can't defend ourselves the terrorists have already won.

If we have learned anything from history it is that power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely.What do we have left to lose when we smile and even THANK those who choose to abuse their meager power as TSA officers?

imrachel
02-15-2010, 03:57 PM
Now THIS is hostile.


See,Sandy, this is where you allow your personal paranoia to cloud your judgment.As someone already mentioned for you, the whittling is an invalid argument as the TSA does specify you are not to bring knives aboard.I guess since you weren't able to come to this not so brilliant conclusion on your own,I'll try to break it down a little for you:

Knitters will be knitting on board.Box cutters will not be cutting boxes on board.That is where the suspicion should kick in.What is this person going to do?Unpack boxes from his move mid-flight?Is he going to be laying out carpet on the plane?Then where is the logic in carrying what could be seen as dangerous in carry on, not baggage?Certainly, the person had a use or they wouldn't go through the trouble right?This is where it should become obvious what he/she is using the box cutter for.The line isn't that complicated.Just think real hard, Sandy :)I'm sure you'll get it if you try hard enough :)


Well, then...your argument on the issue should stop right here.A right is being taken away.When you think of knitting on a plane, naturally you go over to knitting forums and naturally the TSA comes up and naturally you find their site and naturally you get the pdf Jack put up specifying that you may bring needles aboard and naturally you bring them to the airport and are then naturally confused when an institution contradicts the very rules they specified to begin with :) There is a right being taken away; the right to follow the rules and expect to be appropriately treated when you do so.


Actually, Sandy, this is something called littering.It does infringe my rights to walk around and not trip and fall because someone was too lazy to walk over to the designated trash can.Have you ever lived with roommates?Rules on trash come up pretty quickly as your mess would interfere with my right to expect to have access to the stove, bathroom, couch and so on.I am not taking rights away when I prohibit a knife on a plane because those rules were already agreed upon and the person simply chose to disobey.Now if you were to go up to me on the streets and tell me that I am not allowed to own the small knife I wear as a hair clip, I would kindly insist that you shove certain things in certain places and tell you to educate yourself on the standards that have been set in place and then show you how painfully within those standards my knife is.If a crew of S.W.A.T. then came in and tackled me to the ground, put me in prison and confiscated my knife, you'd bet your back side I would have every group who's business it is to defend my rights making those people blush.That would be absurdity.Requesting that you follow the rules would not be.



Am I supposed to feel left out for not having someone dear to me killed in 9/11?If I were you, I'd be at least a little ashamed of twisting someone's unfortunate death to my own advantage because of failure to prove my point without emotional manipulation :/




Actually, Sandy.Going 8 miles over the speed limit is illegal.This is why they call it a speed limit and not a speed suggestion.I don't speed.I don't even go a mile over the speed limit; I tend to go 1 under just in case.It is not my right to speed.It is my right to drive and go the appropriate speed and expect to not be pulled over and given a fine for doing so.I truly hope you learn to respect the right of other people to expect that when they go out on the road, the other drivers obey the law.You would not have to worry about the popo "stealing" your money if you went the speed limit.This is why I drive worry free knowing I will never be fined.

By the way, you're doing a horrid job at keeping terrorist games out of your airspace with this whole paranoiac passion in favor of those who abuse their powers as TSA officers.The paranoia surrounding flights is a result of the tragic 9/11 incidents, and I for one refuse to give into the fear.When we have people here in the US who think it's perfectly fine to freak out and not allow anything on board whether or not it is in within regulation simply because we're a little scared that we can't defend ourselves the terrorists have already won.

If we have learned anything from history it is that power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely.What do we have left to lose when we smile and even THANK those who choose to abuse their meager power as TSA officers?

suzeeq
02-15-2010, 04:14 PM
Instead of a bath towel for a blanket, a large comfy shawl works great too. ;)

OffJumpsJack
02-15-2010, 04:24 PM
Now THIS is hostile.

If you meant your post, I would agree. We all need to keep to a civil discussion by limiting our post to providing new information and polite and constructive comments.

Thank you sue for popping in, I was about to send a PM to you and Dustina to come over for a visit. A shawl is a great idea, but somehow I think me in a shawl would look suspicious. :roflhard:

suzeeq
02-15-2010, 04:26 PM
Wear it around your neck as an oversize scarf....

dustinac
02-15-2010, 04:28 PM
Just wanted to take a moment and link you guys to the forum guidelines...remember we all have the right to our opinions :teehee:

http://www.knittinghelp.com/about/guidelines

cftwo
02-15-2010, 05:21 PM
I've had lipsticks and asthma inhalers considered suspect items - both before and after 9/11. With the lipstick, they even checked my bag for explosives. As a cross-stitcher, I was very disappointed at the post-9/11 rules which both required me to spend more time in airports, with less stuff to do. Somewhat understanding, but still disappointed. As far as knitting needles go, I hope they continue to be allowed on US flights. For short trips, a book is enough, but for longer trips, I like to have some variety in my entertainment, and yarn is a lot lighter than a portable DVD player. But it's good to know that some TSA posts are cracking down on knitting needles. Thanks for the heads up!

Lisa R.
02-15-2010, 05:55 PM
Of course no one here would do anything awful with knitting needles. But there are people who would. I just don't get it when knitters get so irritated about not being able to knit on planes.

I think the problem is that knitting needles are listed on the TSA website as acceptable. If they are listed as "okay" and then some agent uses his power to say no, it's frustrating. Knives are not allowed and are listed on the website as not allowed, so you know up front if you're a wood carver, don't take your stuff in your carry on.

If needles were listed as banned on the website and there were uniformity to the enforcement, the irritation level would be less.

Edited to add: I posted as I read, rather than reading through the whole thread first. I probably wouldn't have jumped into such a hot discussion otherwise. But since I'm hear, I agree with the idea that trying to have the government micromanage our lives so that we are perfectly "safe" is going to backfire. The terrorists have already won. As Benjamin Franklin said, Those who desire to give up freedom in order to gain security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one.

LifeIsGood
02-15-2010, 07:24 PM
I think the problem is that knitting needles are listed on the TSA website as acceptable. If they are listed as "okay" and then some agent uses his power to say no, it's frustrating. Knives are not allowed and are listed on the website as not allowed, so you know up front if you're a wood carver, don't take your stuff in your carry on.

If needles were listed as banned on the website and there were uniformity to the enforcement, the irritation level would be less.



Exactly!

I was taking a knitting class today and posed the issue of flying with needles and the instructor suggested taking a stamped envelope, in the event that they won't let you through with your needles, so that you can mail them home instead of losing them forever.

I will be taking a copy of the page from the TSA website just in case, when I fly this summer. Hopefully it will be a non-issue.:knitting:

imrachel
02-15-2010, 07:30 PM
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If you meant your post, I would agree. We all need to keep to a civil discussion by limiting our post to providing new information and polite and constructive comments.

Ummm, what?:?? I am truly confused by your response. Sandy57th made some comments and asked some question of meowmeowmeow, which understandably, meowmeowmeow may not have liked very much. You said that sandy57th was hostile. Meowmeowmeow then made some very personally directed attacks, saying that sandy57th had "personal paranoia", couldn't come to conclusions on her own, instructed her (or him-- I'm assuming Sandy is female) to "think real hard", accused her (or him) of being "emotionally manipulative", etc., etc. I think that post was extremely hostile (and very personally attacking) and said so. And you think THAT is hostile, self-referencing? :??

I also have to say, I'm surprised at the venom with which both you and meowmeowmeow responded to sandy57th's comments about losing people on 9/11. It sounds like she (or he) lost people that day, as did you. How about a little compassion instead of berating that? I don't know, I find this thread disturbing for many reasons. We're talking about knitting on an airplane. You want to worry about your rights when flying? I fly Southwest pretty often and they now say you can't stand outside of the bathroom doors, that you have to remain in your seat until the person in there comes out. So then someone else beats you to it. And the next, and the next. What if you have to go really badly, as I did on a flight last week? That's very inconvenient and not well handled. That rule bothers me an awful lot more than not being able to knit for a few hours.

Mirl56
02-15-2010, 07:31 PM
I was taking a knitting class today and posed the issue of flying with needles and the instructor suggested taking a stamped envelope, in the event that they won't let you through with your needles, so that you can mail them home instead of losing them forever.



I've heard this before,too - but really, there are no mailboxes at the screening areas! Who will you depend on to drop it in a mailbox for you - the same TSA screener who denied them on the plane?? You'd have to dash out of line, find a mailbox and get back in line again!!

imrachel
02-15-2010, 07:33 PM
If needles were listed as banned on the website and there were uniformity to the enforcement, the irritation level would be less.

They do that intentionally, to keep people from not knowing. There was an article not too long ago about how the TSA shakes up the rules because it helps them catch the bad guys.

etoilechaude
02-15-2010, 08:36 PM
Regardless what is posted on TSA website, it is still up to the individual inspector whether to allow or not. I don't think you'll get to far beyond pissing them off if you try to point out to them knitting needles are allowed.
Very true. But I might feel better knowing that I returned the favor of pissing someone off... unless there are handcuffs involved ;o)

OffJumpsJack
02-15-2010, 10:04 PM
If needles were listed as banned on the website and there were uniformity to the enforcement, the irritation level would be less.

They do that intentionally, to keep people from not knowing. There was an article not too long ago about how the TSA shakes up the rules because it helps them catch the bad guys.

Wow, if that were true, then I guess we should have no objection to randomly assigned strip searches. I mean, the latest attempt was an underwear bomber, so obviously we need to keep the terrorist guessing as to when they may be stopped for a strip search!

No, they do it because they can and people believe that it improves security because it looks like they are "cracking down" on items perceived by some as a risk but which the DHS TSA rules and regulations state are "no significant risk!"

Knitting needles are visible and obvious but pens or pencils are overlooked in pockets and ignored as a threat. That fact actually makes pens and pencils more of a threat to security because no-one would suspect them of being used as a deadly weapon.

Consider Steve Irwin, the crocodile hunter, who died from a barb on the tail of a skate or ray. That barb was no longer than a pen or pencil and had a sharp point just like a pen or pencil but quite unlike most knitting needles (except the smaller, sock sizes).

Should the TSA ban all pens and pencils from all flights?

OldSkool
02-15-2010, 10:50 PM
Instead of a bath towel for a blanket, a large comfy shawl works great too. ;)

You're awesome.:cool:

suzeeq
02-16-2010, 12:19 AM
I later remembered the advice in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy to always travel with a bath towel though. Maybe that's where Jack got the idea.

OffJumpsJack
02-16-2010, 01:02 AM
I later remembered the advice in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy to always travel with a bath towel though. Maybe that's where Jack got the idea.

Nope. My last name is not Dent. Our last lemon of a ride was a Ford and it always let us down. I drive a Saturn. My dear wife (with the heart of gold) drive a Dodge.

Oh, wait... :oo:

:roflhard:

AngelaR
02-16-2010, 03:12 AM
Honestly, if there was some consistency across the board of whether or not needles were allowed, I think we would not get so worked up. I know for sure that I will seriously consider driving to Nawlins for Spring Break instead of flying in and renting a car. My husband likes to drive aimlessly and I like to knit, perfect for a road trip.

I have no idea what I'll do when we fly to Holland. I'll load up my Kindle with tons of mysteries.

cftwo
02-16-2010, 09:22 AM
I agree with LisaR that if they just came out and banned them (as Great Britain has), then you know not to bring them - just as I know not to pack a flame thrower in a carry on. It's the inconsistency which is annoying.

Mike
02-16-2010, 11:38 AM
Knitting needles are visible and obvious but pens or pencils are overlooked in pockets and ignored as a threat. That fact actually makes pens and pencils more of a threat to security because no-one would suspect them of being used as a deadly weapon.

Consider Steve Irwin, the crocodile hunter, who died from a barb on the tail of a skate or ray. That barb was no longer than a pen or pencil and had a sharp point just like a pen or pencil but quite unlike most knitting needles (except the smaller, sock sizes).

Should the TSA ban all pens and pencils from all flights?

Anything you can do with a knitting needle as a weapon could be done with a pen. Plus you could rig a pen up to inject poison.
So yes they should ban pens, pencils only. And of course no pencil sharpener because that has a blade.

I remember a little 4" dowel a Karate instructor had. I forget the name of it but it's an actual Karate weapon.
Anything and everything can be used as a weapon. But you may not fare as well if your 'anything' ends up being a feather.

ArtLady1981
02-16-2010, 03:48 PM
I have no idea what I'll do when we fly to Holland.

I read an interesting alternative posted by Laikabear in the NCIS thread: if you have your knitting on interchangeables, and if the TSA wants to confiscate your knitting...just unscrew the tips from the knitting. That way you only lose the tips, not the knitting.

Here's my expansion on that idea: keep your knitting on KP cords with endcaps as you pass through TSA checkpoints. Pack the "Zephyr" needle tips separately in your carry-on bag. If the tips are confiscated, you won't have to stop TSA, asking to unscrew the needle tips and keep the knitting. And, you won't lose an expensive set of tips. Zephyr's cost just a few bucks. Even if you aren't really fond of Zephyr's...they do work well, and would certainly occupy your flight time!

Of course, have spare parts packed in your checked baggage!
Then you can still knit on land.

Jannette
02-16-2010, 04:36 PM
That's a great idea. I think that's what I'll do when we go to Spain next month. Man I hope I can knit on the plane.

sandy57th
02-17-2010, 03:33 PM
To meowmeow, regarding your post #20. You opened up and revealed a lot about what you think and feel. Thank you. It is helpful and noted.

OffJumpsJack
02-24-2010, 01:10 PM
I think I have found this enlightening documentary of effective security methods.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mfq15gTSt64 :)

Once I saw that it all made sense to me. ;)

GinnyG
02-24-2010, 01:31 PM
Indeed!!! I think printing off the TSA page is a great thing to do!!! I am a STUBBORN brat though :o)
I have not read all the responses so forgive me if I am repeateing. The problem with doing that is the "fine print" which gives the TSA agent the right to remove anyone or anything from the airplane that in "their opinion" poses a threat. Which means if you wave the printed word under their nose and piss them off you just might find yourself removed from the airplane.

I don't travel alot but I understand from my patients (may who travel extensively because we are a Universtiy town) that the TSA agents have all the power and you do nothing to make them angry.

Mike
02-24-2010, 01:44 PM
I have not read all the responses so forgive me if I am repeateing. The problem with doing that is the "fine print" which gives the TSA agent the right to remove anyone or anything from the airplane that in "their opinion" poses a threat. Which means if you wave the printed word under their nose and piss them off you just might find yourself removed from the airplane.

I don't travel alot but I understand from my patients (may who travel extensively because we are a Universtiy town) that the TSA agents have all the power and you do nothing to make them angry.

If being shown the rules makes them so angry they take out petty vengeance on someone they need a complaint filed. That would be good use of the free time acquired from missing the flight.

They have power but they don't have a right to abuse it.

N0obKnitter
02-24-2010, 02:34 PM
I flew from Vancouver to Denver with my long as heck knitting needles and nobody batted an eyelash, I don't think they're blunt, either. :confused:

GinnyG
02-24-2010, 03:37 PM
Indeed!!! I think printing off the TSA page is a great thing to do!!! I am a STUBBORN brat though :o)

If being shown the rules makes them so angry they take out petty vengeance on someone they need a complaint filed. That would be good use of the free time acquired from missing the flight.

They have power but they don't have a right to abuse it.

TRUE TRUE TRUE, but I don't want to take that risk when I'm headed off on a trip!!

sprig
02-24-2010, 05:10 PM
im a very paranoid flyer ... not cause of terrorist attacks just cause flying gives me a ton of anxiety and i dont like taking medication ... but knitting and crocheting really relieves alot of stress for me ... and id much rather focus on stitches than every bump i feel on the plane... that might be a selfish way of looking at it but i am by no means a terrorist and i dont see why i cant quietly knit for hrs on a flight... i do think its a good thing to protect yourself as a consumer and take along a copy of the tsa rules ... being educated might piss off the people at the air port ... but at least it will show u are not willing to let people make choices for u ... information helps any one know what they are choosing ... and that type of integrity is respected by me indeed.

N0obKnitter
02-24-2010, 05:12 PM
im a very paranoid flyer ... not cause of terrorist attacks just cause flying gives me a ton of anxiety and i dont like taking medication ... but knitting and crocheting really relieves alot of stress for me ... and id much rather focus on stitches than every bump i feel on the plane... that might be a selfish way of looking at it but i am by no means a terrorist and i dont see why i cant quietly knit for hrs on a flight... i do think its a good thing to protect yourself as a consumer and take along a copy of the tsa rules ... being educated might piss off the people at the air port ... but at least it will show u are not willing to let people make choices for u ... information helps any one know what they are choosing ... and that type of integrity is respected by me indeed.

I'm also a nervous flyer, from YVR to PDX it was tur-bu-lence..even the flight attendant was perturbed. I had to shut my eyes, hold my pentacle I sometimes wear and try to empty my mind/meditate/breathe slowly. :hug:

sprig
02-24-2010, 05:16 PM
my daughter stole my pentacle so i am with out one at the moment looks better on her any ways ... and luckily i have no flights planed at the moment or i might steal it back

N0obKnitter
02-24-2010, 05:26 PM
Ebay probably has tons for el cheapo, eh? I actually have two, a friend gave me one.

sprig
02-24-2010, 05:46 PM
at this time money is pretty tight and im not sure i could squeeze jewlery into my budget but i might give it a shot in the next 2 weeks

N0obKnitter
02-24-2010, 10:37 PM
Aww :(.

When you have enough $:

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=pentacle+pendant&_sacat=0&_trksid=p3286.m270.l1311&_odkw=pentacle+pe&_osacat=0&bkBtn=1