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Jan in CA
11-30-2011, 05:48 PM
from a man who really understands! I thought this was a great article. Let's not get political here..this is just a kudos to him. :thumbsup:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/yashar-hedayat/a-message-to-women-from-a_1_b_958859.html

DogCatMom
12-01-2011, 02:19 AM
Wow. What an incredible analysis.

DCM

justplaincharlotte
12-01-2011, 03:04 PM
Excellent article. It's nice to see a man express it so well and with such understanding.

jess_hawk
12-03-2011, 10:13 PM
Can I hug the man who wrote that? :hug:

And can I get someone to beat some of the men (and a few women) in my life over the head with it? In particular my father? mmmkay thanks.

bambi
12-04-2011, 09:22 AM
Jan, thanks for that, really. I can't tell you how many times a week I hear that from my own spouse. "take it easy." "peace." "don't get so upset, I was just kidding."

Wears me out. Glad to know I'm not the only one.

Wanda Witch
12-04-2011, 04:08 PM
Too bad there aren't more 'real' men out there like the author. I forwarded it to a friend who had endured a particularly poor situation for years. The spouse is now gone but the memories for her linger on. Oh, yes, I too have heard some of these comments made to me during our almost 48-year marriage. I try not to pay attention but, well, sometimes one cannot help but be affected. Great article.

Jan in CA
12-04-2011, 05:25 PM
I'm glad you're all liking it! I'd be surprised if there was a woman who had never heard comments like this.

saracidaltendencies
12-04-2011, 09:38 PM
Very nice article.

While I can fortunately say in all honesty I do not recall ever hearing this, if I ever do I can guarantee whoever says it will regret it. I've been through too much in my life to allow anyone to try to undermine me or make me feel inferior. I know how strong I am and I know what it took to build that strength and I refuse to let anyone try to bring me down and tell me the way I feel is irrational or wrong or that I'm just being emotional. I'll stand my ground and prove any SOB wrong.

Never forget, anyone, the tremendous strength we are all capable of and we should never, ever allow anyone to take that away.

Lighting57
12-06-2011, 01:23 PM
I understand this mentality and believe most men, especially the older men, whether they are aware or not, use this behavior toward women.

They have not been taught how to talk and reason well with their peers, let alone females. Since they have no knowledge of or how to openly talk they use this as a way to shut females down. If we shut up (and ignore the elephant in the room then we can just go on tiptoeing around it) they don't have to deal with the issue at hand. Life continues to go smoothly for them the way THEY want it too.

By nature we all are selfish, but this mentality has really made men selfish in that things must be a certain way most of the time (their way or no way). When we buck the system, we are labeled as rebellious or worse.

The phrase, "Stop, just calm down now", does more to set me off probably more than anything. After 36 years of marriage we have finally learned to talk to each other and that's sad. Our marriage could have been so much better throughout the years if we had just learned to listen instead of talking.

My question is, "Although the man that wrote the article seems to understand it all, does he continue to gaslight certain women in his life?

justplaincharlotte
12-08-2011, 03:40 AM
I understand this mentality and believe most men, especially the older men, whether they are aware or not, use this behavior toward women. . . .

My question is, "Although the man that wrote the article seems to understand it all, does he continue to gaslight certain women in his life?

Good question.

I found it fascinating that my 21 yr. old daughter, after reading this article, and responses from women of my generation to it, found it interesting enough to post this on FB about it.

Interestingly enough, she finds it that women (of her age) are doing the majority of gas lighting now. Her comments:

"A man makes a joke, and the woman takes it the wrong way, he's sexist. He opens a door, he's sexist. He insists on doing 'manly' chores, he's sexist. THEN women complain that he doesn't do these things. Sorry ladies, you can't have your cake and eat it too. I feel bad for men."

Is it really possible that the situation has reversed?

And perhaps, have we taught the lesson incorrectly?

I can't say these are rhetorical questions, but rather they are legitimate given the apparent attitudes of the young. My daughter isn't the only young one who has voiced similar sentiments to me.

What say you? I'm trying to figure all of this out...

jess_hawk
12-08-2011, 02:47 PM
I wouldn't say that the situation is reversed: certainly I find myself and my female friends facing a lot of this behavior from men - both older generations and my own age... and even younger guys!, merely that women are ALSO gaslighting men.

On the whole I think the point here is twofold:
We need to - all of us! - be more sensitive to the ways in which we use words to manipulate others and not use that manipulation in a harmful way.

We also need to - all of us! - be less sensitive about people being people. Just because someone finds a joke funny when it brings up a stereotype, doesn't mean that the person is sexist, racist, etc... they only have to be aware of the stereotypes. In fact, those sorts of jokes are often funniest when you are aware that the stereotype is there, but rarely holds true! And stereotypes happen. Our brains are programmed to generalize.
The same is true of emotional expression. Men and women feel and express emotions in different ways. Individuals feel and express emotions in different ways. Instead of trying to force everyone to be PC (which in my opinion often leads to a situation where the formerly disadvantaged come to feel entitled and get belligerent when they are treated as equals instead of being given preferential treatment) can we all please just try to lighten up? Keep an open mind instead of getting self-righteous when people don't act and speak and look exactly the same way we do?

justplaincharlotte
12-08-2011, 04:11 PM
Jess_hawk, thanks for helping me understand what my daughter was trying to get across. I'm truly afraid that I may have hit that stereotypical age where we start to see things through one somewhat myopic lens. Walk uphill to and from school, barefoot & in the snow with me, anyone?? ;)

stitchwitch
12-08-2011, 08:32 PM
My Mom is the Queen of Gaslighting! I'm surprised that over the 44 years that I have known her I haven't died of gas fumes!
My husband on the other hand has never used this technique, thankfully. But, I have plenty of friends whose husbands do.

GrumpyGramma
12-14-2011, 10:22 PM
Very interesting article. I too was glad to read it. It's good that he explained but didn't grovel for being male. Somehow men have heard that what they're doing isn't how it should be but haven't had anyone really teach them what to do differently, at least that's my take. Maybe it's because society in general hasn't figured it out.

Yes, Charlotte, women do it too. What I find most disturbing is that it's done to children, both boys and girls, by moms and dads. They're told to suck it up, there's nothing to cry about, etc., then will do the same when they are adults.



I looked up the word hysterical at dictionary.com and found:

Word Origin & History

hysterical
1610s, from L. hystericus "of the womb," from Gk. hysterikos "of the womb, suffering in the womb," from hystera "womb" (see uterus). Originally defined as a neurotic condition peculiar to women and thought to be caused by a dysfunction of the uterus. Meaning "very funny"
EXPAND
Online Etymology Dictionary, 2010 Douglas Harper
Cite This Source
Merriam-Webster
Medical Dictionary

The idea that women are less than is very deeply rooted.

Thanks for posting this, Jan.